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Poster: Administrator, Curator, or StaffMonte B Cowboy Date: Jun 27, 2012 7:53am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Colorado is burning - real, real, bad

Boulder-fire.jpg
helicopter drops water on the Flagstaff Fire on June 26, 2012, in Boulder (photo by Jeremy Papasso)

Which way will the winds blow today?

What are NASA Scientists, and 97% of the World's Leading Climate Scientists saying? Bill McKibben is an environmental author of a dozen books about the environment. He says, "Warm air holds more water vapor than cold air. The Earth is getting warmer now. The planet's climate is 4% wetter than it was forty years ago. This causes devastating weather extremes that are linked to human-caused climate change." McKibben was interviewed about this last year.

Atmospheric CO2 levels have increased dramatically since 1900, when The Industrial Revolution took hold. Today these CO2 levels are being measured at 392 ppm. Increasing our annual CO2 emissions cannot be sustained.

• Conclusion about Global Warming Facts Reported by The Mainstream Media:

Mark Hertsgaard is an investigative reporter who has worked for more than 20 years on climate change. He is the environmental correspondent for The Nation magazine. His new book is Hot: Living Through the Next Fifty Years on Earth.

In an interview last year Mark Hertsgaard says, "[Here's] the problem. They [U.S. Senator James Inhofe, Fox News, U.S. Mainstream Media] are climate cranks. They like to be called "climate skeptics." And the media, I’m very sorry to say — the mainstream media, at least — calls them climate skeptics. They are not skeptics. Genuine skeptics are invaluable to science. That’s how science progresses, is with skepticism. But a true skeptic can be persuaded by evidence. They cannot. They have made up their minds for economic reasons or ideological reasons that they’re not going to believe in this. And because our country has allowed them to dominate the debate for 20 years, we’re now stuck with 50 more years of rising temperatures."
It’s very important to stay calm. If you got upset about any of this, you might forget how important it is not to disrupt the record profits of our fossil fuel companies. If worst ever did come to worst, it’s reassuring to remember what the U.S. Chamber of Commerce told the Environmental Protection Agency in a recent filing: that there’s no need to worry because “populations can acclimatize to warmer climates via a range of behavioral, physiological, and technological adaptations.” I’m pretty sure that’s what all the Sheeple are telling themselves.

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Poster: AltheaRose Date: Jun 27, 2012 8:03am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Colorado is burning - real, real, bad

Btw Monte by "science isn't that simple" I didn't mean I give credence to the climate cranks -- good phrase (though I think a lot of the so-called "skeptics" aren't so much "cranks" as just "paid by ideological think tanks") -- I just meant that any one incident, or any series of incidents, can't definitively be blamed on "climate change" because weather, climate change, etc is complex. It's like cancer; we may know X causes cancer, and we may know that person Y has ingested X and later got cancer, but we can't definitively say that X caused Y. So IMO it's reasonable to associate the fires with global warming; they just didn't (and couldn't) come with a little promo that says "brought to you by global warming"!

Anyway, I think you all have been through the climate change discussion; just wanted to clarify.

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Poster: Administrator, Curator, or StaffMonte B Cowboy Date: Jun 27, 2012 8:34am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Colorado is burning - real, real, bad

There are millions of people in your region being impacted by this. Pakistan had historic flooding in 2010, leaving one-fifth of the country submerged. The monsoons are going to be altered. Snowpacks are melting rapidly where you are, so, that means sources of water will be gone soon. It's totally devastating. What I'm saying is, all this is happening right now, very quickly, under our noses, and our world leaders are saying and doing nothing. What about our kids?

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Poster: AltheaRose Date: Jun 27, 2012 9:07pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Colorado is burning - real, real, bad

Definitely we're being impacted. Record keeping isn't good enough here to make a solid comparison, but as far as the records we DO have go, we've had record highs. I'm helping out a researcher on some related stuff on that right now. (Impact of climate change.) Which I'll get to once I stop procrasting on the forum, LOL.

Btw I don't think we have to know the exact, precise, water-tight causes to draw reasonable conclusions and take the best actions we can. If you're on the Titanic, you don't argue whether the "true cause" was an iceberg or a design flaw or something else!

What about our kids? Well, mine says things like, "Great planet you guys are leaving us." All I can really say is lame stuff like, "Uh, well, I don't use plastic bags ..."

:-(

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Poster: ringolevio Date: Jun 27, 2012 7:52pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Colorado is burning - real, real, bad

Leaving off the climate change arguments, Monty, are you personally affected at the moment? I can't quite figure out where you live. I hope you are not in harm's way!

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Poster: William Tell Date: Jun 27, 2012 10:46am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Colorado is burning - real, real, bad

It depends what you mean by "science" of course; idiosyncratic, singular events, can sometimes be explained in their entirety by "science", but you make the point that devastating fires are more complex.

To answer Monte's implied query, "why is Colorado burning?" we might find it's "absence of fuel load reduction due to suppression" + "regional drought" + "construction in fire prone ecosystems" + "climate change" or some such...hard to know without meta-analyses across many areas, time periods, etc., as to whether we can ascribe "96% attributable to climate change" or some such.

Except when I am teaching it, or droning on about it hereabouts, then SCIENCE is black and white, eh?

;)

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Poster: Mandojammer Date: Jun 27, 2012 12:11pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Then there's this.........

Al Qaeda's Inspire Magazine Returns, Recommends Forest Fires As Next Great Terror Innovation


http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/05/03/al-qaeda-inspire-magazine-returns_n_1475695.html

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Poster: SomeDarkHollow Date: Jun 27, 2012 11:42am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Colorado is burning - real, real, bad

As I'm sure you're aware, Northern AZ has a huge problem with the amount of tinder in the form of dead/dying trees (a huge numer of which can be accredited to draught and/or previous fires). Plus we always have another huge problem with mental midgets leaving campfires not properly extinguished. Add in the marked increase in lightning strikes during our monsoon season and we have potential for massive problems this summer.
Now if we could increse funding for (and acceptance of) thinning along with making arson a federal crime punishable by firing squad we'd make a big dent in the number and severity of these blazes. The only plus though of the extended draught we've had is that with a virtually precipitation free winter, there is much less underbrush to add fuel. Well, I've got to head up to Payson and throw a few cigarette butts out the window...

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Poster: DeadRed1971 Date: Jun 27, 2012 2:34pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Colorado is burning - real, real, bad

In Chicago they blamed it on a cow.

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